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Message # 5811.2

Subject: Re: Visa/MasterCard

Date: Wed 10/09/03 02:16:04 GMT

Name: WetBert

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Your comment about "so much for the land of the free" is what initially made me want to respond. Vi$a and Ma$tercard are businesses just like you. They want to make money (not just recoup some of their expenses) and are probably trying not to get sued in the future (a favorite American pasttime these days) by some parent who's child bought "porn" over the internet. Whether they are going about it in a reasonable manner is arguable. The point is, though, that our American "free market economy" means that as a business they are "free" to do this. You, Nigel, are doing exactly the right thing. YOU are "free" not to do business with them. If I may exaggerate to make the point, you are free to charge $500 for one of your tapes. We, the wetlook community, are free to decide whether we want to pay that much or not. While a price of $500 would definitely impact your sales, it's doubtful there will be enough "outraged" people to make any real difference to the banks. However, we do have other options. I recently bought something on EBAY from Canada. I purchased an International Money Order (or some such thing) from the US Post Office and mailed it to the seller. He shortly thereafter mailed me my purchase. No, it's not as fast or easy as a credit card and no, not everyone who might buy a tape with a credit card would go through the extra trouble. But it IS another option. My fear would be if our government decides Vi$a and Ma$tercard aren't doing enough and THEY step in. When the banks make up a new rule I can take my business elsewhere. When my government makes a new rule I don't have that choice.

Sorry for the rant. I'm a firm believer that "Every dark cloud has a silver lining. And 84 people a year are struck by lightning looking for it!"

In reply to Message (5811)

How Visa/MasterCard want to 'protect' us - A bit of a rant, but relevant :(

By Nigel - nigel@wetlook.com Wed 10/09/03 00:03:43 GMT

Website: www.wetlook.com

As you may have realised, us producers are having a harder and harder time having credit card orders processed. Although we all like to give stuff away for free, and we are only really in the WAM game because we love it so much, we do try to recoup some of our expenditure.

The powers that be in Vi$a and Ma$terCard are adding tighter and tigher control on 'Adult' businesses (I'm not going to comment of the political aspects to this). For this reason, Multicards, and many other card processing companies are restricting what we can do.

Already US Banks have had to stop handling offshore clients, and the latest news from the European banks is that they are only able to process orders for Tangible Products (VHS + DVDs, not streamed content or memberships). This sounds fine for me (Minx Movies) for example, but wait a minute, there are contiditions...

The website is only allowed to show 'box covers', not any 'previews' ( picture galleries, or AVI/MPEG downloads) UNLESS they are 'protected' by an 'Adult Check' type system. I can only presume that this is Vi$a and Ma$terCard's vague attempt to 'clean up' the Internet.

If they manage this to acheive this, then before you enter ANY vaguely adult site that is selling stuff then you will need to subscribe (and pay annually for) an 'Adult Pass'. This will hurt all WAM producers, we barely scrape enough sales to cover our costs, and anything that puts off casual browsers is very bad news.

Even inside the US you are going to have problems, I've recently switched my transaction processing to ozbill, based in Australia, but there are moves afoot to block or question any US citizen making a 'foreign' (outside US) payment !!! So much for the land of the free. (I've already had 1 customer's card turned down, they had to contact their bank to complain before the transaction finally went through).

Personally I am voting with my wallet, I will be applying for an Amex card later this week, Vi$a and Ma$terCard can go whistle for any more commission from my shopping.

Nigel

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