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Message # 51649.1.2.1.1.1.1.1.1.1.1.1.1 Subject: Date: Fri 02/09/11 15:07:27 GMT Name: Mahoney |
Report Abuse or Problem to Nigel at Minxmovies
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| I didn't ask for unblocking. I just really want to get the debt of my conscience. Maybe he will let me pay in some other method. I am not a bad guy, really, trust me ;) |
In reply to Message (51649.1.2.1.1.1.1.1.1.1.1.1)  Thanks for the reply, but...
By Mahoney -
thank you for the first real reply I've ever seen from you. But quit being so self-centered. What I wrote does not border on libel. The customer service - like you presented till now, even in this thread - is very bad and arrogant. And not using either download managers or resuming broken downloads without warning is unethical. You have the right to do both. But people have the right to criticize it. That's called freedom of speech.
As for my case I said exactly the same about my case, as you wrote - except that you inflated the amount to hundreds of dollars. Yes, I still haven't repaved Eric. But as I said it was not my error, it was the banks. And I offered to repay by any method except the one you gave me, which makes me pay 80 Euros bank fees to the bank that made the mistake in the first place. If Eric's well being is what you care about, then why not make a link for the amount and let me pay by CC. You can then wait 10 days (after that time you cannot do a chargeback in Poland) and then you will be sure that it is all back. Also he could give me a street address and I would send him the money. I'm a medium sized law abiding sociologist from Warsaw, I'm not gonna send a gangster to his address or something. Be realistic. There is no threat or problem for you in any of these methods. But you want to punish me for my mistake and make me pay 80 Euro, more then a 100 dollars to a greedy bank that made the mistake in the mistake in the first place. As I offered to pay back the amount WITH the fee you (or Eric) had to pay to your bank I think this is just you being cruel for the fun of it. I feel really bad for the fact that I still owe Eric the money as I have (and never had) any other such debts in my life. However my bank is greedy enough and Poland is a country in which 80 Euro is still a lot of money, so I refuse to pay such a fee for the transfer. Even Western Union wants less and a next day UPS-courier service is more then 4 times less!
As for the censorship you want - on this forum you almost always got it. This time I just think it wouldn't fly. I said nothing against forum rules. So there was absolutely no case and the thread stayed. Probably you were also pissed by the "mafia" comments. But if your censorship succeeded for a long time and all criticizing posts where deleted with no reply, though they broke no forum rules, you can be a bit pissed and use words too harsh. I am sorry if you feel offended by my words. That was not my intention. |
In reply to Message (51649.1.2.1.1.1.1.1.1.1.1)  Re:Thanks for clearing up the hosting issues...
By soundguy -
cl@themothership.net
Mahoney, you wrote: I once made the mistake of making a chargeback against one of the producers using the system (an honest mistake, there where many fraudulent charges in the days and this one was real, but the bank annulled them all). I contacted the producer and the Mothership and offered to pay them back. They offered me just ONE choice - by absurdly pricy international bank transfer, not by paypal or the Mothership itself. They also blocked my whole ISP, all my credit cards etc. And when I complained here about the way the Mothership is run (in a thread by another user who had problems with them) I got a very abusive reply on the forum and then the whole thread was deleted - so the forum admin here is also not immune to the "mafia's" practices and his censorship is at their disposal. In that thread others asked about important issues and I asked about treating customers better and giving second chances. It's a violation fo Visa/MC operating rules to accept reimbursement for a credit card chargeback via a credit card, particularly the one used in the fraudulent chargeback. For weeks after your banning, you steadfastly denied any involvement in the transactions and repeatedly claimed that some other mysterious stranger (who just happened to share your last name, email address, and several other identifying characteristics) was responsible. When you finally admitted that you were involved and that the chargeback was an error, you were given a chance to reimburse Eric the several hundred dollars he lost as a result of your chargeback spree. Regardless of who is at fault for the chargeback, he is the one was robbed of all that money. Need I remind you that you already downloaded all those videos, so you got them for free? As you had already denied involvement several times, no one was willing to accept your payment via any method that could result in another chargeback event such as another credit card or PayPal. You had (and still have) the option to reimburse Eric via cash or a bank transfer. It's been almost TWO YEARS and you STILL have not repaid your debt. You want a second chance? Pay what you owe and then we'll talk. Until then, stop whining about it. The main issue was also that when sites use Vdown/Mothership they use NO ALTERNATIVE. That's complete bullshit. All Mothership clients have the ability to manually create transactions (memberships, DVDs, and downloads) and they are free to accept alternate payments. Many of them have PayPal accounts and virtually everyone accepts cash in the mail. All you need to do is contact the producer directly and make arrangements for a payment. Most of what is being said in this thread is completely false and much of it borders on libel. If you wonder why I rarely show up in this forum and my responses tend to be succinct, it's because I really don't feel like hanging around on a system that constantly allows this kind of agenda trolling and petty, childish axe-grinding. |
| In reply to Message (51649.1.2.1.1.1.1.1.1.1) Thanks for clearing up the hosting issues...
By Mahoney -
It is complicated. Still I would think it would be ideal if all wetlook sites worked like Flaviu's Eurowam. He uses well known and trusted credit card processors like CCBill and has a fast and reliable hosting service, as I always get maximum download speeds there on my 20mb/s connection. On many other sites, I get much reduced download speeds, despite the fact that it really isn't such a great connection, sometimes reduced to the download speed I could get in the days before broadband... Anyway, I think were making an off topic here and Nigel might get pissed, so I'll stop writing ;). Hope you get that answer from Soundguy on his own unethical business methods, but somehow I doubt it :( |
| In reply to Message (51649.1.2.1.1.1.1.1.1) Re:Yes, well
By Malvineous -
mrnemesis@ntlworld.com
I doubt Erik could do anything about it; I can't complain about his personality as I'm hardly Mister Personality myself ;-) Yes he needs a better host, but it's a difficult market because high volume hosting is expensive and wetlook isn't a high profit market. I have no idea what he's paying Soundguy, what his profit margins are, his download volumes or anything, so I couldn't really comment even if I was well versed in hosting solutions, and I'm not. I doubt he is, either, to be honest – it's a confusing market even if you do understand computers. And of course it needs to be a solution with an integrated payment provider and integrated download store as Erik couldn't program that. It's a complicated deal, and ideally you'd pay a developer to write a custom solution, as Mark Kelly has done – they use all custom solutions now for their new sites. However, this costs a lot more money and it's probably Mark's position as being in charge of so many sites that affords that sort of budget. A single lone photographer of wetlook would never have that sort of budget.
I moved WetInRed over to Dreamhost, and subsequently Liquid Ladies, REG Productions and InterWet USA, as they're a very reasonable bunch and I needed a company who weren't rule Nazis like many other comparable companies – they won't just delete your site without a reason and leave you in the cold. They don't have the same high speeds of Globat, but Globat was run by a bunch of retarded monkeys (and eventually they decided they didn't like us any more as we violated some rule they wouldn't explain, so we had to pull out) -- at one point Globat accidentally wiped the whole WetInRed site!
Dreamhost has worked out well (although I was always worried that we were using too much of their nominally unlimited bandwidth and space – some companies utterly refuse to provide the space and capacity advertised, which is surely illegal) but there's no integrated store, and I never had the interest to figure something out. I think the new webmaster was going to sort all that out. |
| In reply to Message (51649.1.2.1.1.1.1.1) Re:Yes, well
By Mahoney -
As for Erik I was just saying that he was unsympathetic with my problem (maybe he didn't believe me) and didn't help at all with the Mothership's attitude. But if you say that Soundguy is as he is, well then I understand Erik's attitude. I just don't understand why he still uses the company and not some other one. As for Bravenet, I just thought you were a long time here too and assumed it was that long, but maybe not :). |
In reply to Message (51649.1.2.1.1.1.1)  Re:Yes, well
By Malvineous -
mrnemesis@ntlworld.com
Soundguy is, so far as I understand, a sound guy ........ I have no idea how he got into wetlook hosting.
I could boycott Vidown, although I don't honestly know who hosts what any more. And since Erik uses the Mothership, and I want to buy from Erik ...
I feel a little confused though – you're saying Erik is mean? Or Soundguy? I don't have any complaints about Erik at all, and I'm certainly not criticising him – he's always seemed a really decent guy. He asked Wetgod for some help with his site a few years back, after it had just been set up by Soundguy, and Wetgod forwarded the request onto me as, at the time, I was the Liquidladies webmaster (and was until recently, albeit very reluctantly ;-). I was keen to help Erik – there were tons of bugs in the code that were causing real problems – but Soundguy wasn't so keen and intimidated Erik, who backed down and wrote his own site instead of letting me fix the bugs in Soundguy's code. That would have been an excuse to finally learn Perl, although I was offered a job a few weeks after that as a Perl programmer so I ended up learning Perl anyway and I still use it to this day. (I'm also glad that Weinerking has found a more willing webmaster for his sites! I only took over them after Steve died.)
I wonder who on Bravenet you're mistaking me for – I wasn't there! |
In reply to Message (51649.1.2.1.1.1)  Yes, well
By Mahoney -
when you are named one of the "greats" in a something for years, it is enough to go to one's head it seems. Doesn't seem to matter how small the something is. Of course you got the producer right. Funny thing how he is so mean, while Leon and Flaviu are so charming in their mails. I understand how they charm models, I don't how he get's any. But maybe this is why he has no StreetSplashCandid/WetlookHunter type of site... ;). However thankfully as we can see in wetlook this does not affect all. Leonmoomin, Flaviu, Messmaster, AllWam, Styx etc etc have very professional, ethical and just plain nice customer service. Some others do not. In a normal market, they would go bankrupt after this many years of treating customers badly, but here it seems people don't really care. Anyway, my annual wetlook bill of about 600 euro, might not be much for them, but still, they are not getting it, while Leon and Flaviu and some other sites are. That's the way we can "vote" and the more people are treated badly by them, the more will vote with their euros, dollars and pounds. However it is nice to see, that we regained freedom of speech... or is it only temporary? Two people, posting here since Bravenet (I am, I think you too), criticizing the way of the "greats"... I wonder if this can last long. |
In reply to Message (51649.1.2.1.1)  Re:Malvineous - watch out, you are playing with fire!
By Malvineous -
mrnemesis@ntlworld.com
I never doubted it for a second – I've already been involved in an episode where he was intimidating Erik Elsas, one of his own customers. |
In reply to Message (51649.1.2.1)  Malvineous - watch out, you are playing with fire!
By Mahoney -
Vidown/Mothership etc is something like the wetlook mafia. They do a great deal for the community, but they are self-righteous and give absolutely no second chances to anyone. I once made the mistake of making a chargeback against one of the producers using the system (an honest mistake, there where many fraudulent charges in the days and this one was real, but the bank annulled them all). I contacted the producer and the Mothership and offered to pay them back. They offered me just ONE choice - by absurdly pricy international bank transfer, not by paypal or the Mothership itself. They also blocked my whole ISP, all my credit cards etc. And when I complained here about the way the Mothership is run (in a thread by another user who had problems with them) I got a very abusive reply on the forum and then the whole thread was deleted - so the forum admin here is also not immune to the "mafia's" practices and his censorship is at their disposal. In that thread others asked about important issues and I asked about treating customers better and giving second chances. The main issue was also that when sites use Vdown/Mothership they use NO ALTERNATIVE. Another mafia-like tendency. Since that time little has changed, however Leonmoomin has started using PayPal and judging by comments here about the service - it is widely popular, so many more people had problems with Soundguy's business. Also he always replies like the "anonymous" reply to you. In rude short sentences and ignoring most of the content. Anyway, what can you say for a company that gives no second chances, but is not fair on their side. The thing you are righting about is breaking all netiquette rules and should be stated before you buy anything using the Vidown/Mothership system. And as for his replies (like the one he gave you). Well, normally a company with such "customer service" with be out of business, but here Soundguy has the backing of MK, Leon and the Admin, so you see...
PS: I am very aware, that this post will probably not show at all, be deleted or I might even get a ban for it, but sorry guys, I come from a country that was under fascist and communist rule for decades, we know true censorship here and if there are important issues we speak up. Freedom of expression is important. And so is doing business not only legally but also ethically (we didn't have that till 20 years ago also). So people here are just not that willing to give that up. Even if constructive criticism of some people here is like criticism of the mafia in Naples or Moscow. Especially as times have changed and the old greats like MK no longer hold the community in their hands. They have with no doubts great achievements in the past, but as old empires usually fall, now with the absolutely free HQ Russian material, Flaviu's superb Eurowam (using normal mainstream CC processors) and Leon using Paypal they don't even have their great weapon - "banning". |
In reply to Message (51649.1.2)  Re:Vidown and DownThemAll!
By Malvineous -
mrnemesis@ntlworld.com
You're interfering with download managers by intentionally adding random bytes to Content-Length? That's pretty abusive. It's always frustrated me that browsers ignore Content-Length, because I can never be quite sure that I've got a whole download (lots of servers drop connections randomly under load), and then Internet Explorer always returned the cached copy of the incomplete file instead of trying again (that may be fixed now). The reason Alexander Clauss never implemented Content-Length checking in the iCab browser for the Macintosh was due to the number of sites that return incorrect figures for this header, which was hugely frustrating as it meant trying to get iCab's resume to recognise that a file wasn't complete when the browser swore that it was ...
I always feel contempt for anyone who wilfully violates specifications. There is always another answer that doesn't involve lying to the client software. The worst one I saw was the MacHTTP web server which would actually deliberately send back corrupted files under certain circumstances, which was liable to crash your software and possibly the whole computer back before Mac OS X came out.
Download managers provide numerous services: a) download several files at once, b) download different segments of the same file at once, c) resume broken downloads, d) queue files so you don't have to spoon feed the downloading. MP3 stores tend to zip up all your files for you, but that's not as practical when every download is larger than a zip full of MP3s. The fact that you need a download manager is a testament to the lack of imagination on the part of browser authors: only iCab on the Mac had comprehensive download manager built in, and Internet Explorer for Macintosh had a download manager that supported resuming and queueing. The Windows world loses out hugely here.
Now, you don't have an issue with downloading multiple files at once. The problem of software grabbing multiple segments of the same file at once, should be an easy one to deal with: when an incoming Range header is received, check whether the final byte offset equals the final byte of the file. If it does, then the user agent is attempting to resume a broken download. If it isn't, the user agent is trying to download multiple portions at once. In this case, you can either return 416 Requested Range Not Satisfiable to reject the request, or do what I did at WetInRed, and simply return 200 OK together with the complete file to simply pretend that we don't understand ranges at all (may not be the right thing to do ;-) That way, you annoy greedy download managers, and permit both queueing and resuming. (The only reason this isn't all still running at WetInRed is their incorrect understanding of memory usage limited me to five concurrent PHP script executions so my passthrough script became a denial of service bottleneck. It's also probably a WTF that Linux doesn't offer a more accurate way to measure memory consumption, but that IS a difficult problem to deal with as text pages can presumably be shared by different users.) |
| In reply to Message (51649.1) Re:Vidown and DownThemAll!
By Anonymous -
It's not a bug. it's intentional. I do not support download managers. |
| In reply to Message (51649) Vidown and DownThemAll!
By Malvineous -
mrnemesis@ntlworld.com
There's a bug in Vidown's Perl-based passthrough system wherein the Content-Length of downloads is randomly mis-reported by a few bytes (but always by the same amount for the same file – I don't know what he's doing wrong, although as a Perl programmer I may be able to figure out where he's going wrong). Browsers ignore incorrect Content-Length headers (sadly) but DownThemAll! is smart enough to check it, in order to support automatic resuming. In this case, however, Vidown doesn't provide resume support (which is pretty trivial really) so DownThemAll! is trapped in an infinite loop re-downloading complete 400 MB movie files because the site won't report the right size.
When you put in a large order with someone like Erik Elsas, it would be very useful to be able to queue up all the files and leave it running as there's hours of downloading to get through. I don't use DownThemAll! for acceleration – in fact I successfully campaigned for better support for intelligent unaccelerated downloading. I just want a queue facility, so I can leave all the downloads going without having to sit at my PC for hours nannying it. I had a much larger set of files to download from Mostwam, but they use a different system ad the queue completed flawlessly while I spent most of the day away from my PC.
I reported this bug ages ago to Erik who passed it on to Patrick at the Mothership, who refuses to look at the problem. I don't imagine there's any way to persuade him to actually fix this?
(I doubt he'd let me add resuming support to his code, either.)
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