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Message # 23828.1.1

Subject: Hello Re: Re: msg 23811 (kayakking)

Date: Wed 26/07/06 04:43:07 GMT

Name: A Stranger in Warsaw uu

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We need Andrew in on this discussion. Like him, my wife's a Pole, and he may be able to explain my wife's jealousy better than I. In any case, while I wholeheartedly agree that there's no such thing as normal, unfortunately lots of people have a perception of what normal is, even if they can't agree on it. Andrew wrote that people swimming clothed is normal, but my wife's reaction contradicts that. Most people take clothes off to go swimming, thus forcing others to see them in their underwear, which many Americans object to if the underwear is brief-style (aka 'slips' in German, Polish, maybe others); or they don't go into the water. We on this forum live to see those chosen few who are easy-going enough to swim with the clothes still on. My wife is simply embarrassed to be with me when I'm wet with clothes on, AND dislikes wet clothing so much that she doesn't like to see me get in the water with them on. Get a special cover for the car seat? What a silly way to spend money! she'd say. Depressed
In reply to Message (23828.1) Hello Re: msg 23811 (kayakking)

By regenman - regenman@planet.nl nl Tue 25/07/06 05:14:14 GMT

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>> But I really don't think 'clothed swimming' is considered normal-- otherwise, my wife wouldn't object to it so much

 

I wonder why exactly she objects. Is she embarressed by it, even if she is not there? Seems unlikely. Could it be a kind of jealousy? Is she afraid you like the water better then her? She needn't worry. I think it's very unlikely you will run away with a pond and have an illegal child with it.

 

>> and people wouldn't look at me funny.

 

What is considered normal? Are things normal when 90% of the people do them? If so, then I'm a VERY abnormal guy. Kayakking in itself is abnormal, as is listening to classical music, reading a book, even being an atheist. All these things may be considered strange, and all of them will get you funny looks every once in a while. The main difference is your own feeling about it. While you may be proud of your tastes in music and literature, you "have" to be ashamed of a love for wetlook.

I'm often amazed by what is considered normal and what's not. Like: A man may wear tights if he's running or cycling. If he wears them while just walking, he is a crossdresser or a lunatic. Or: People feel comfortable wearing a swimsuit at the beach, but when they wear them in the city they will feel naked.

My most funny experience on that point was in a sauna, when I visited one for the first time. I had gathered that people go to a sauna naked, but I asked at the desk, just to be sure. So OK, I hung around naked in the pools, the sauna's and the showers without drawing any attention - but then I entered the bar! Nobody told me that you /should/ wear a bathrobe when you go for a drink! I thought it was incredible that a group of girls that I had shared a hottub with minutes ago were suddenly pointing ang giggling at my nakedness!

 

>> The thing about this fetish is how pessimistic it's made me. Murphy's Law rules it dictatorially.

 

I found that the more relaxed you are about it, the easier it gets to lure people in. If you take some companion to the beach and just walk in, without even stopping the conversation, lots of people will just follow your lead, no questions asked. It made that happen dozens of times. There may be some (nice) comments afterwards, like these that I actually got or overheard, all from different girls:

- I will NEVER go out with you again without a spare set of dry clothes (after 3 outdoor trips that ended up soaked).

- Suddenly I was wet up to my waist, my pants and panties all soaked, and I really don't know how it happened!

- These trips with Reg are nice, it's just that you always end up wet and dirty.

- You really like that wet lycra? I prefer jeans.

- Rain is nice, it's just that it's not raining hard enough.

- Hey, try this! If you stir the mud with your feet bubbles of air come out, and when you trap those with your shirt it feels amazing!

- No, I'm not going in. I want to dry out - for the next 10 minutes.

 

>> But we weren't wearing shoes-- we were instructed to take them off! I even goofed and left mine on shore when I pushed off.

 

Strange cultural differences... Anyway: Wearing shoes is not my own idea. It's a rule in most dutch clubs, even seakayakking clubs. I really think it's good safety advice.

 

>> But why is the slow-dry characteristic of cotton a problem? If you're wearing the wet clothes to cool you, it's better for them to be wet longer, right?

 

True - at least, in hot weather, but the weather is not always like this. My advice on clothing was not meant for your trip on thursday, but more in general. By choosing the right clothes you can extend the wetlook season (and the kayakking season) from early spring until late fall.

 

>> But somehow it feels conspicuous to keep the socks on when wading into the water.

 

True again. Personally, I don't mind funny looks so much, as long as I got some reasonable explanation when somebody asks. If they don't, I really don't care what they think.

When I wade in wearing just socks and no shoes, I wouldn't have a response, so I prefer to do that in private.

 

>> I'll report for sure. But don't expect pictures. I'll keep my camera safe and dry-- in the car.

I can live without the pictures, but I'm looking forward to your report.

 

Reg

 

In reply to Message (23828) Hello Re: msg 23811

By A Stranger in Warsaw - uu Mon 24/07/06 23:55:02 GMT

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Yeah, they're young'uns. I wouldn't invite the 'older, moral' group. But I really don't think 'clothed swimming' is considered normal-- otherwise, my wife wouldn't object to it so much and people wouldn't look at me funny. Now, when women do, I like it, but when men do, I don't. I take that as an artifact of my straightness, but I don't know if there's more to it than that.

In any case, I won't have to pretend I'm hot. With this weather, I will be. The thing is, I would of course have taken them boating Monday since they weren't prepped for swimming, but Thursday, they likely will be. Or they won't go. (The thing about this fetish is how pessimistic it's made me. Murphy's Law rules it dictatorially.)

 

I find it likelier that we'll use paddleboats. They're easier to get in and out of.

As for kayaking, I've only done it once. (We canoe far more often in the States, and we consider kayaks tippier = less safe!) Since it was early September at 10*C in the morning, we were even wearing jackets, and none of us swam. (Half our little group being my parents, I did NOT go swimming. But I sure want to go back to that nice, clear water...) But we weren't wearing shoes-- we were instructed to take them off! I even goofed and left mine on shore when I pushed off. Of course, they weren't there when we came back. Angry

 

But why is the slow-dry characteristic of cotton a problem? If you're wearing the wet clothes to cool you, it's better for them to be wet longer, right? Sure worked yesterday. I had a nice long walk in the sunshine to drip off after my swim, and I was completely comfortable. I'd have felt far hotter in just a swimsuit. Heck, I do feel hotter now, just sitting at the computer in shorts. But when I got home, I changed-- I was tired of the wet underwear.

 

And socks are another funny issue. Certainly I feel just that bit more clothed with socks on, as I do with a belt. But somehow it feels conspicuous to keep the socks on when wading into the water. I just might wade in today, pants rolled up at first, of course, but I'll probably take the socks off before going in. The shoes can be excused as protection, but socks? I like them because they keep my feet cleaner, but I just can't find a justification that onlookers would think of on their own.

 

I'll report for sure. But don't expect pictures. I'll keep my camera safe and dry-- in the car.

 


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